From: Dan_Williams [#1]
28 Jul 21:19
To: ALL
Good evening, NFP! Yes, we're back for another week, in spite of the public outcry demanding we stop. These guys are in a similar position as Paul Menard - they have sponsorship whether they deserve it or not!
Here are the topics for this week, please feel free to chime in with your own thoughts! :thumb:
Dan: The Brickyard 400 is supposed to be one of NASCAR's premiere events. Why were there so many empty seats at the track?
X: Boredom. Surprisingly Sunday's race was pretty good there but generally it's a snoozefest. That track wasn't designed for stockers.
I don't think this one can be blamed too much on the economy, the tickets there are relatively inexpensive compared to other tracks.
People still aren't traveling as much though.
Willy: willys top 5
5. the repeated attempts at trying to murder fellow competitors by carl manson has taken its toll on many.tens of thousands have fled the sport and now attend chinese thumb wrestling tournaments.
4. seven dollar beer and five dollar hotdogs.
3.americans disdain for the french. François Debris shouldnt have been allowed to invade and impact the chase.
2.the bodines.
C. dale earnhardt jr.
PS: just speaking on the brickyard attendance, i say the 100 degree felt like temperature didnt help matters.
anybody that remembers the july dega race crowd knows why they changed dates. ive seen dega half empty.
Larry: All the "usual" reasons being thrown out there, BUT, Indy has 245,000 seats . . if it's half full (or half empty) it still has more seats than most of the other tracks.
SG: agree with Larry here. i dont think nascar has ever sold as many seats as the open wheelers have for that track an i doubt they ever will. if i recall correctly, i ont think that was ever their intention at that venue.
willy: to a certain point i agree with larry as well.im comparing the NASCAR events at Indy in my opinions.comparing apples to apples last Sunday was the worst attendance for any previous Brickyard 400. rumor is that they will not be asked back after 2012 if things don't change. IMO thats hypocritical coming from a sanctioning body that only has 1 race a year that draws a press worthy crowd. jes my 2 on that.
X: I attended a couple 500's and the first 400. It was fun watching them come through the short chute and work turn 4.......other than that you lose perspective and can't really tell what's going on. Great place to go and party and say that you were there, but not the best facility to actually watch a race.
SG: i wish they didnt build that infield area.
but yes, that track needs something like race buddy. ill say, besides phoenix, i think it provides the most potential for good racing. imo.
X: Daytona's the same size and 'Dega's bigger...but you can still manage to see the whole track from most of the seats. That's not happening at Indy.
Willy: after seein kenny showin the spotters locations i wonder if there ever was a time you could see more than what was directly in front of you. and ennybody that can see whats goin on at dega between when they enter 2 and come out of 3 has better vision than me or they are lookin at the jumbotrons i rely on. :cheers:
X: Once upon a time I used to carry my trusty Canon into the track with a 400mm zoom on it, wasn't too much I missed. After they started cracking down on what you could take to the track it came down to my camera bag or a cooler. :hmm: Indy has too many buildings and trees in the infield that block your view. It looks nice, but kinda obscures your vision.EDITED: 28 Jul 21:38 by Dan_Williams
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From: Dan_Williams [#2]
28 Jul 21:35
To: ALL
Willy: Juan Pablo Montoya restarted the race 7th with 4 fresh tires and 18 laps to go. Plenty of time to return to the front. Did over driving his car as well as being angry, do more to cost him a Brickyard win than the decision to take 4 tires instead of 2 ?
X: I'll go with angry and overdriving. Biffle was in the same situation and finished....what....3rd? Unless something happened with a tire that they didn't tell us about. :noidea:
At least Brett Bodine didn't get mad at him and take him out. :sarcastic:
Willy: Exactly ! Although he hasn't commented on the deal I'm betting he won't take any responsibility for crashing. IMO the CC made the right call !
Larry: The car was set-up for clean air . . started on the pole . . he planned to run in front all day . . couldn't run good in dirty air with the set-up . . PLUS "someone" was up in the corner stands disposing of empty chaloopa skins . . hehehe . . makes the car "push".
Willy: yew werkin pr fer juan.that sounds jes like something his people wud send out. instead of what i suspect happened " On lap 183 after not getting his way and being the angry diva drama queen he is, Juan decided to go all carl manson on the 42 Target Chevrolet and Dale Jr."
Willy: quote: Larry
PLUS "someone" was up in the corner stands disposing of empty chaloopa skins . . hehehe . . makes the car "push".
LMAO ! yew wudnt have a clue as to who that mite have been wud ya ?
SG: quote: X
I'll go with angry and overdriving. Biffle was in the same situation and finished....what....3rd? Unless something happened with a tire that they didn't tell us about.
my exact thought, but that wasnt necessarily obvious with the jpm motor racing network focusing so much on monty while the biff motored right past and forward on that same restart. biff picked them off pretty good lap by lap from that point until he found himself behind the 29.
both of which i would say put to rest the old "you cant pass at indy" line, all during the race. as did the race winner an monty while he was running well an a few others while they had their setups working
that 42 just did not seem to move after that pit stop.
ill say that created the greatest anger and the rest is history
Willy: my take on it was he was trying to move up to quick.hence the wall kiss.cold stickers,IMO, may have needed a lap or two more to become a factor.
SG: if you can get a replay, look for biff. he starts either behind or besides also on 4 stickers.
that car moved forward and the 42 looked like slugo. im thinking even i would be pissed off in that car at that point. i truly think it failed to respond like it had at any other point during the race.
i think some adjustment went south on that pit stop
Willy: good point.i really would like to see a replay.if biff shot forward with 4 cold tires then why didnt juan. of course im still of opinion juan was so pissed he didnt give it enough time to try. and the what else was adjusted, air pressure, wedge etc on juans car may be more of a factor than we know. would be nice to see comments from juan and the key players IMO.
SG: yeah biff moved from the git go but the jpm motorsports network did everything it could to ignore that.
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From: CommieCanuck [#3]
29 Jul 8:31
To: Dan_Williams [#2] 29 Jul 8:42
I think that's what double file restarts will bring you. Even if you have the better car with four fresh tires if you get caught up behind a few slow cars you're going nowhere. Conversely if you don't have the greatest car, you're 10th on the last restart; but you're able to to find a line between or around guys that have been battling each other all day you may end up with a top 5. It really shakes things up which is all we can ask for.
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From: Racer X (RACERX) [#4]
29 Jul 10:08
To: CommieCanuck [#3] 29 Jul 11:32
I'd like to see them adopt the "Delaware double file" that the dirt tracks use. The leader is by himself and gets to pick his lane, everyone else doubles up behind him.
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From: yooper (AWAX) [#5]
29 Jul 10:27
To: Racer X (RACERX) [#4] 29 Jul 10:43
Yes, They do that at our track also.Reply
From: 2flames4 [#6]
29 Jul 10:29
To: Racer X (RACERX) [#4] 29 Jul 10:43
That's the best idea. No reason the leader should easily lose the lead after he worked to get it.
Unfortunately, it makes too much sense and won't provide enough drama so nascar won't adopt it. :sarcastic:Reply
From: Onlyone3 [#7]
29 Jul 10:57
To: 2flames4 [#6] 29 Jul 10:58
Actually, 'd like to see them do that too. The leader single, followed by double row.
I think actually, that often the leader got there trough pitstop rather than earn it on the track. This way he'd have two cars up his ass to worry about. Pretty hard to block both.
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From: 2flames4 [#8]
29 Jul 11:01
To: Onlyone3 [#7] 29 Jul 11:04
Sometimes it works like that, but sometimes we also see a guy waaaaaaay out in front (because of clean air, better car, off-sequence pitting, whatever), and it's not fair to him that after getting there that he automatically has a car restarting right beside him after nascar throws a late-race phantom caution.Reply
From: Onlyone3 [#9]
29 Jul 11:06
To: 2flames4 [#8] 29 Jul 11:14
LOL. I'd rather have the car beside me. Pretty hard for him, or the car behind to get a run on me. Two behind and you can be sure one or both will. With a car outside(or inside) you race him, he is a block for one lane.
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From: 2flames4 [#10]
29 Jul 11:15
To: Onlyone3 [#9] 29 Jul 11:27
Until you spin your tires on the restart and finish second, like :tape:Reply
From: willy.rilly (PWILLY) [#11]
29 Jul 17:00
To: ALL
why should a restart be any different than the start of the race ?
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From: 2flames4 [#12]
29 Jul 17:06
To: willy.rilly (PWILLY) [#11] 29 Jul 17:14
Because the pole sitter has the entire race to get the lead if he gets jumped on the start.
After nascar has a restart with 2 to go because of a phoney baloney imaginary debris caution, he doesn't have that. So his only recourse is to jerk around with the start by trying to stack up the field and then people hate him for it and start chunkin cans. :biggrin:Reply
From: Clutch [#13]
29 Jul 17:14
To: Dan_Williams [#1] 29 Jul 18:04
These guys are in a similar position as Paul Menard - they have sponsorship whether they deserve it or not!
I think the Menard is getting better all the time and proving that he does deserve a ride......whether he has a rich daddy or notReply
From: Racer X (RACERX) [#14]
29 Jul 17:18
To: willy.rilly (PWILLY) [#11] 29 Jul 17:24
Why not? They screw around with everything else. :sarcastic:
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From: willy.rilly (PWILLY) [#15]
29 Jul 17:24
To: 2flames4 [#12] 29 Jul 21:25
Because the pole sitter has the entire race to get the lead if he gets jumped on the start.
absurd. the theory. not yew.yer ok, :thumb:
double file or single file. the only consistently fair way to start races at any point.
the drivers were more instrumental in the double file being added to the restarts than anyone else.
its just like any other call,rule or ruling. fans of the drivers that benefit love it until their driver has problems then its NASCAR sux.
now hep a bruther out. what does the double/single debate have to do with the question? im lost?
corse thats normal. :faint:
:cheers: :1nanner: :1nanner: :cheers:
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From: willy.rilly (PWILLY) [#16]
29 Jul 17:26
To: Clutch [#13] 29 Jul 17:54
These guys are in a similar position as Paul Menard - they have sponsorship whether they deserve it or not!
I think the Menard is getting better all the time and proving that he does deserve a ride......whether he has a rich daddy or not
i agree :thumb:
we are too. :rofl: :cheers:
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From: willy.rilly (PWILLY) [#17]
29 Jul 17:28
To: Racer X (RACERX) [#14] 29 Jul 17:28
Why not? They screw around with everything else. :sarcastic:
exactly my point.they were screwing around with a double standard. going double file for all starts is not screwing around.
:cheers:
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From: Racer X (RACERX) [#18]
29 Jul 17:32
To: willy.rilly (PWILLY) [#17] 29 Jul 18:46
:cheers:
I do like the Delaware doubles though....but then the dirt races usually aren't more than 30 laps.
With today's A.D.D. society, maybe NASCAR would be better off with running short heats and a feature to keep everyone's attention. :noidea:
Or not.
:cheers:
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From: Pete [#19]
29 Jul 18:02
To: Racer X (RACERX) [#18] 29 Jul 18:28
The closer they go to old style racing on shorter tracks, the better off Nascar will be. Top continue in the direction they have been travelling ever since the Brian /Helton/Darby show started is pure folly.Reply
From: dj8t8 [#20]
29 Jul 18:42
To: willy.rilly (PWILLY) [#15] 29 Jul 18:46
Amen Brudder!!
If the leader was good enough to get to the front...
He should be good enough to stay there.
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