NASCAR Front Page > NASCAR may test fuel injection in a handful of 2011 races:

Ron Dennis was at Indianapolis Motor Speedway on Saturday to discuss several topics including the upcoming introduction of fuel injection in NASCAR. Dennis, 63, is the executive chairman of McLaren Automotive.

He was the team principal of McLaren's Formula One team until last year, helping win eight drivers' championships. "I'm here representing my group of companies, specifically my (McLaren) electronics company," Dennis said. "We're hoping the commitment to quality and excellence is something that will allow us to become selected by NASCAR in production for some of the fuel injection and some of the other safety benefits and ecological benefits that we can bring with some of the technology that we have.

" Jack Roush met with Dennis on Saturday morning and discussed the transition of fuel injection in NASCAR. Roush said McLaren Companies has a proposal in to NASCAR to bid on fuel injection. But Roush believes the change will come with a price. "Don't think that it's going to be less expensive," Roush said. "It's going to put a burden on the teams. Any time you bring in a new technology that is complex, there's a cost. And there will certainly be a cost for the teams. It's likely to occur sometime in 2011. I think we've all heard the same thing.

I don't think it will be more than a handful of races. Maybe start with the (Budweiser) Shootout. That would be my suggestion. They might do that, then look at the end of the year and see what they think about it, then full time in 2012."(Fox Sports

From: sg (SOLARITE_GUY) [#2]
25 Jul 11:47
To: Razin-Kahne [#1] 25 Jul 12:53

But Roush believes the change will come with a price. "Don't think that it's going to be less expensive," Roush said. "It's going to put a burden on the teams. Any time you bring in a new technology that is complex, there's a cost. And there will certainly be a cost for the teams. ;(Fox Sports

From: sg (SOLARITE_GUY) [#3]
25 Jul 12:59
To: Razin-Kahne [#1] 25 Jul 19:59

Former McLaren Formula 1 boss and McLaren Group co-owner Ron Dennis is in attendance at the Indianapolis NASCAR event this weekend supporting McLaren Electronics’ bid to become an official supplier as the sanctioning body works on making the transition from carburetors to fuel injection.

MES is hoping to become the sole supplier of standard ECUs to all NASCAR teams, following similar deals the company has in other series. It is currently an official supplier both in Formula 1 and the IZOD IndyCar Series, and now hopes to get involved with America’s biggest racing series.

NASCAR has yet to announce when it will apply electronics to its cars’ fuel intake systems, but Dennis said his company would be ready to become a supplier as early as next season. He believes MES’ experience in other forms of racing and some technological alliances his company has done in the US, makes its bid an ideal fit for NASCAR.

“I think when it comes to McLaren trying to differentiate from other possible suppliers, first, our electronics company has been around for 20 years, secondly, we’ve partnered with Freescale, who’s the biggest American producer of semiconductors and we opened facilities in Charlotte two years ago,” said Dennis.

“We’re proud of the statistics. If you say give me some headlines, we’ve supplied every Formula 1 team for three years and not one team has had electrical faults at either practice or racing in three years. We’ve done the same in IRL [IndyCar] and we are a very cost-effective technology because we have bullet-proof reliability and for NASCAR one of the things that we can absolutely guarantee is tap-proof systems and the ability to very carefully monitor anything that even remotely looks like it’s being interfered with.”

Dennis stated his company has already been working for some time on its involvement with NASCAR and that series officials had underlined the importance of ensuring that the technology should not impact on the fans’ perception of the series. He assured fans they would not be able to differentiate between a car running a carburetor and one using fuel injection but that they would appreciate the series getting in line with the auto industry in terms of green initiatives.

He also said he found his first ever NASCAR visit “fascinating” and admitted to being surprised by the level of sophistication he found in the garages, having been critical of the series in the past.

“It’s more sophisticated than I anticipated it,” said Dennis. “Cars are beautifully prepared, there’s no question about that. Obviously there’s some strong tradition in NASCAR racing, which you’ve got to respect and it’s there for a reason.

“Clearly there’s a tremendous desire to maintain equality and try to create interesting racing and clearly there’s some big commitment from NASCAR officials to be even-handed. Processes are clearly very diligent and well considered and there’s definitely a more relaxed atmosphere, but that I was expecting.”

Dennis will be in attendance for the Brickyard 400 race, where his former McLaren driver Juan Pablo Montoya will start from pole position. The pair split right after the 2006 United States Grand Prix at the same venue, following the Colombian’s announcement of his multi-year NASCAR deal. Dennis admitted to being “impressed” by Montoya’s form in qualifying.

“He seems to be getting the job done,” said Dennis. “I don’t know if he made the supreme effort today to impress me, but he has. I somewhat doubt it.”

From: willy.rilly (PWILLY) [#5]
25 Jul 14:19
To: sg (SOLARITE_GUY) [#2] 25 Jul 14:21

i was turning wrenches when the big 3 went from na carbs to efb to throttle body then to fi. a big learning curve too for the tuners.

From: willy.rilly (PWILLY) [#6]
25 Jul 14:21
To: scrfan [#4] 25 Jul 14:23

jeeeezzzz .......ee-kon-ahh-mee iz inna tank ....sponser-shyps are hard ta kome bye ...so "brian" inn hiz inn-fynate wys-dom says ...lets put more of ahhh financial burdon on teems ........dern that guys bryl-yant .........

From: scrfan [#7]
25 Jul 14:25
To: willy.rilly (PWILLY) [#6] 25 Jul 14:32

From: sg (SOLARITE_GUY) [#8]
25 Jul 14:30
To: willy.rilly (PWILLY) [#5] 25 Jul 14:32

lol. what a pre-emptive typo. guess i could have said "theres a lot of lost steps" in there too.

another thought here too, i'll say it will make for lazier work on port design, if they take a path that leads to a dry air stream or even one that introduces the fuel jut prior to the valve.

From: sg (SOLARITE_GUY) [#9]
25 Jul 14:34
To: willy.rilly (PWILLY) [#5] 25 Jul 14:36

From: willy.rilly (PWILLY) [#10]
25 Jul 14:36
To: sg (SOLARITE_GUY) [#8] 25 Jul 14:37

lean mixtures and burnt pistons would be a thing of the past with fi. of course lets not forget what controls the deal. computers. a whole new monster that nascar abhors.

From: sg (SOLARITE_GUY) [#11]
25 Jul 14:42
To: willy.rilly (PWILLY) [#10] 25 Jul 14:59

that may depend on how the efi is allowed to operate. they may require the tuner to set a fixed pressure and a set pulse range depending on rpm.

if they allow the use of wideband o2 sensor feedback, then yes, BUT i dont care what dennis says, there is a way to fool anything

From: willy.rilly (PWILLY) [#12]
25 Jul 15:00
To: sg (SOLARITE_GUY) [#11] 25 Jul 15:22

From: sg (SOLARITE_GUY) [#13]
25 Jul 15:23
To: willy.rilly (PWILLY) [#12] 25 Jul 15:25

From: willy.rilly (PWILLY) [#14]
25 Jul 15:26
To: sg (SOLARITE_GUY) [#13] 25 Jul 16:05

From: Jr (28FAN) [#15]
25 Jul 19:16
To: willy.rilly (PWILLY) [#5] 27 Jul 17:12

"Don't think that it's going to be less expensive," Roush said. "It's going to put a burden on the teams. Any time you bring in a new technology that is complex, there's a cost. And there will certainly be a cost for the teams

does roush not make you think of the Cheshire cat here? he is talking like all the top teams do not already have test engines running with some form of FI already.
I think this changeover will go fairly smoothly. the big 3 already sell crate engines that are designed to have a carb stuck on the top or a FI set up.
and well toyota probably reverse engineered their heads from FI to carburated fuel delivery

couple things not trying to be a smart ass, just providing info - saying fi is covering a very broad spectrum until you know exactly what product/technology is being used.

then regardless of what the final decision is, the logistics side of the house will make a very big turn over of basic materiel for an area that has had very gradual turn over the last 60 years or so.

unfortunately, this may also force some personnel turnover as some of the carb guys just might not understand some of the fi stuff.

in my heart i hope they all "get it" as both a carb and fi REALLY do the same things, when considering their basic purpose, they just execute differently.

as for the toy cup heads, those along with every other cup head is in reality a second or third generation rendition of the basic concepts put forward by the heads robert yates introduced as the m-6049-c3 - whether sequential in design of mirror in design.

the f1 multi intake and multi exhaust valve arrangement and the nascar "simple" 2 valve arrangement take very different paths with regard to best cylinder filling - note a flow bench queen does not necessarily fill the cylinder the best - and, i think it is quite honest to say these 2 valve heads have better flame management properties than any 4 or 5 valve design.

From: willy.rilly (PWILLY) [#18]
27 Jul 17:13
To: Jr (28FAN) [#15] 27 Jul 19:45

From: willy.rilly (PWILLY) [#19]
27 Jul 17:16
To: sg (SOLARITE_GUY) [#17] 27 Jul 20:12

wouldnt fi deliver fuel more evenly and consistently. seems i remember our motor guys dealing with lean cylinders under extreme banking and g forces.

From: sg (SOLARITE_GUY) [#20]
27 Jul 20:15
To: willy.rilly (PWILLY) [#19] 27 Jul 20:20

BUT theres a ton of ifs ands or buts i could describe, such as, it it was a TRUE throttle body with TB injection, guess what ? pretty much the same exact problem.

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